Changing careers is never easy, especially when you go from a non-tech industry into a tech one. In the past, you would have to have a tech degree. But how is it now? Does that still apply?
That is what I am going to ask Ladislav Cicon, a QA Lead at Wandera in the Czech Republic. Ladislav has a tech degree. He worked as a QA Tester and Analyst throughout his career. Now, as a QA Lead, he hires QA Engineers/Software Testers. Let’s look at his answers to my above questions:
Hello Ladislav, thank you for accepting my interview! I believe that it will help a lot of people to understand the in and outs of getting a Software Tester/QA Engineer job. As I saw in your LinkedIn, you have a tech background so it probably was not hard for you to become a QA Engineer and later a QA Lead, right? Do you still remember your first QA Engineer job interview?
Sort of. I finished CTU, but I don’t have a degree in computer science. I studied communication networks so my background is a little bit in physics and signal processing, less in programming. Maybe this broad knowledge keeps me in software testing instead of development, who knows :).
I still remember who was at my first QA Engineer interview and some bits of it. I was quite stressed, still a student and it had been probably one week I had learned that software testing even exists. It was ~11 years ago, I got the job and that job brought me to the field of software testing which I have liked ever since. So I know how stressful an interview can be for a newbie and I’m trying hard to be human at my interviews.
Now you work as a QA Lead so I suppose you are participating in hiring new QA talents. Do you feel like it is hard in the Czech Republic to find good quality QA Engineers/Software Testers? And if so why?
I do act as a hiring manager for testing roles at Wandera so I interview people and try to help with our efforts to attract talent.
The part of attracting the right people is not that easy and this plays a big role in hiring. But the quality of ‘Quality Engineers’ who I interview is usually high and I’m happy about that :).
What kind of personality are you looking for in a QA Engineer/Software Tester usually? What personality types make a good QA Engineer/Software Tester in your opinion?
I like to interview curious people who have met interesting challenges on the way. People who are not focusing on testing only. Someone who demonstrates that she/he learned and tried new things in their daily job, software testing, or technology-wise is often pleasant to interview.
And if there are some personality traits that make a good QA Engineer? I’d say no, comparing to other engineering roles. But there is one difference though and it is that testers usually need to have a broader skillset. Not to focus solely on software development but to combine software development via test automation, testing skills, and other, often interpersonal/communication skills. These are important for software engineers as well but crucial for QA Engineers.
So in my opinion a good QA Engineer is a curious learner and versatile engineer. I know it’s easy to say but that’s the software tester’s role nowadays.
You told me that you don’t have much experience with hiring a QA Engineer/Software Tester with a non-technical background yet? Was it because there were no non-tech people applying for the position? Or the people who applied were not able to program or grasp technical concepts?
I interviewed and hired too few people without technical background so I prefer to say that I have little experience interviewing non-technical people.
We build quite complex and hi-tech cloud products at Wandera so it may repeal non-technical people and they probably don’t apply at all.
Although non-technical people may lack some skills and ‘background’ in software development, these skills can be learned if the person is curious and dedicated. Even if he/she lacks experience this can be gained and demonstrated working on pet projects or open-source projects.
Have you ever hired a person who took a coding bootcamp or some kind of quick course but did not have a degree in computer science? If so, was there much difference between people with a degree and a course in technical skills?
I hired a colleague who doesn’t have a tech degree but learned testing skills in his previous job. Then I hired a few people who dropped out of technical uni after a few semesters and learned the skills on the job and from online courses.
It’s definitely doable, but it needs to come with strong motivation. As my colleague said at the discussion on this topic ‘you need to be able to debug the code for hours to add an exclamation mark’. Expecting that 3 months of an afternoon course about software testing and test automation will make you a great tester can lead to fallacy. Those skills need to be applied to real problems and real systems.
Since you have been working in the industry for some time, do you believe that there could be any pros to having a more versatile work experience when starting as a QA Engineer/Software Tester?
I believe that the more experiences the better, and it definitely can help QA Engineers as well. I already mentioned that the tester’s job is broader. Specifically in our teams at Wandera having a background as a networking admin would help.
Similarly for other companies. It can only help if you have experience similar to the targeted market or in finance while working for a bank.
Is there an easy way to recognize whether a person without a tech background will have a hard time to learn technical skills? Could perseverance, grit and resourcefulness (like being able to find the answer on the Internet) help even out the lack of a tech degree?
No, it is not easy to recognise to be honest. But perseverance and grit are important for someone entering any new field.
But I’d add that googling thing is not learning it the hard way. Most people need to explore endless dead ends for learning to stick. This is similar to tech uni. There you spend hours in the lab or in front of your computer to try it. And I also think that it is similar to any other field of learning.
On the other hand tech and even interpersonal skills can be tested at the interview :).
Do you feel like having a testing certification helps to become a successful QA Engineer/Software Tester with or without a tech background? If so which one?
I personally don’t think so. Maybe you are at the start and entering the field of software testing, certification may help to navigate you at the beginning. It can make your first QA interview easier, but that’s about it. It does not predict if you will or won’t be successful and it probably won’t make you ready for changes in the field which are just happening.
What is the one thing (if there is one) that the QA Engineer/Software Tester candidate should not mention in the interview? For example, I heard that some candidates said that they just wanted to try testing or they wanted to do testing only to become developers etc. Would that make an influence on how you decide about such a candidate?
These are really good questions and there are many more for me. The one you said is sad, but unfortunately, the software testing industry has this stereotype 🙁 So I’m not happy to hear this at an interview because I build a culture where the role of QA Engineer is a career path if the individual likes what this role takes.
Then I don’t like hearing ‘as a tester I provide information to the business to decide’. This is just alibistic and if something is wrong you need to find the business language and reasons why to fix it and ideally support your opinion with the data. The next step is to persuade business stakeholders with it, they do care for quality because lack of quality is very often impactful on business.
Is there anything else you would like to add that could help prospective QA candidates without tech background when looking for a software testing job?
As already said you need persistence and grit. It is always a good idea to participate in the testing of open source projects or contribute to test automation there. You can learn skills online at Codecademy, Udemy or real-life courses, but this way you can practice your skills and show some experience. With these, I will be happy to meet you at Wandera :).
It was my pleasure to share my knowledge with you and your readers, Helena.
Thank you so much for making time to answer these questions. I believe that your input will help a lot of people!!!
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